A question for any active duty member

I am a part of O.I.F 2. I have been told that this is no longer a combat zone but it is a rebuilding stage. From time to time we still recive fire. Could some one please tell me the difference in a combat zone and a rebuilding effort? I am in the Army National Guard and have not had much active duty time so your input would be very helpful thank you.

[Field_Sailor]

I'm sure I'm probably gonna get an ear full for posting this but...

I don't know if there is a technical defintion..A combat zone is anywhere hostiles are in the area and have the potential to cause you harm. You don't actually have to being shot at to be in a combat zone, but have the potential for it.

As far as a rebuilding effort, I think that refers to your mission.

Get it? One is a job, the other is just what's going on... RR, sand flea etc..., feel free to correct me, I'm wearing flak.

Thank you for your answer.

Your getting hazardus duty pay. Iraq and Afganistan are both still considerd combat zones.

[USMCRET6391]

Originally Posted by brian

Your getting hazardus duty pay. Iraq and Afganistan are both still considerd combat zones.

I agree, if you are getting "combat pay" you are in a combat zone, makes difference whether you are destroying or rebuilding.

[RR691983]

You are in a combat zone. What you are incorrectly being told is a bend of what bush said back in March(I believe) he declared an end to MAJOR combat operations.

We all know this to be false, but we're now "assisting" the Iraqi National Guard, etc.

Don't be confused though. You are still very much in a combat zone. You're recieve HF/IDP correct?

[Covertness]

What is little known is that we had a number of suppossed allies who told us that as soon as The President announced the end of major combat operations, they would send troops to Iraq to help out. That was why George Bush said that on the carrier. Unfortunately, in the end, these "allies" re-negged on their deal and did not send the troops as promised.

Yes, we are getting all combat pay and thats why I couldnt understand why I had herd that we was no longer in combat but we were in a peace effort to rebuild. I never could see how you could be at peace and still be shot at. Thanks.

[Field_Sailor]

What Covert said is absolutely true. He was advised to say that by, his staff becasue of our allies.

all of iraq and afghanistan are still consider a combat zone....should get the pay and a combat patch....just recieved my third patch two days ago....

[Field_Sailor]

3 patches? How does that work? You ahve been there three times, obviously rite? or is there a different way?

Side question: hypothetical:

I have a 5 Soldiers working for me. We are on a convoy in Iraq, we come under fire, we shoot back, we win our little "battle." Lets say oh, 0 US casulties, 10 Insurgent casulties. Do my soldiers earn a combat patch for their unit?

[SGTBelcher29]

The section of AR 670-1 that pertains to the 'combat patch'-

28–17. Shoulder sleeve insignia-former wartime service (SSI–FWTS)
a. General. Authorization to wear a shoulder sleeve insignia indicating former wartime service applies only to
soldiers who are assigned to U.S. Army units that meet all the following criteria. Soldiers who were prior members of
other Services that participated in operations that would otherwise meet the criteria below are not authorized to wear
the SSI–FWTS. Wear is reserved for individuals who were members of U.S. Army units during the operations.
(1) The Secretary of the Army or higher must declare as a hostile environment the theater or area of operation to
which the unit is assigned, or Congress must pass a Declaration of War.
(2) The units must have actively participated in, or supported ground combat operations against hostile forces in
which they were exposed to the threat of enemy action or fire, either directly or indirectly.
(3) The military operation normally must have lasted for a period of thirty (30) days or longer. An exception may be
made when U.S. Army forces are engaged with a hostile force for a shorter period of time, when they meet all other
criteria, and a recommendation from the general or flag officer in command is forwarded to the Chief of Staff, Army.
(4) The Chief of Staff, Army, must approve the authorization for wear of the shoulder sleeve insignia for former
wartime service.
b. Authorization. Authorization applies only to members of the Army who were assigned overseas with U.S. Army
organizations during the following periods.


NOTE: Due to the listing of numerous operations specified, I am cutting directly to OIF and OEF


(13) Operation Enduring Freedom: from 19 September 2001 to a date to be determined, for soldiers assigned to
units participating in Operation Enduring Freedom. Soldiers must have been deployed in the CENTCOM area of
operations and been under the command of the CINC, CENTCOM. Soldiers who were deployed in the area of
operations on training exercises or in support of operations other than Enduring Freedom are not authorized the
SSI–FWTS, unless those exercises or operations became combat or support missions to Operation Enduring Freedom.
(14) Operation Iraqi Freedom: from 19 March 2003 to a date to be determined, for soldiers assigned to units
participating in Operation Iraqi Freedom. Soldiers must have been deployed in the CENTCOM area of operations and
been under the command of the CG, CENTCOM. Soldiers who were deployed in the area of operations on training
exercises or in support of operations other than Iraqi Freedom are not authorized the SSI-FWTS, unless those exercises
or operations became combat or support missions to Operation Iraqi Freedom.
c. How worn.
(1) Non-subdued. At the option of the wearer, individuals who were members of an Army unit during one of the
operations listed above may wear the non-subdued U.S. Army organizational SSI of a wartime unit (para 28–17b) that
was approved by HQDA on the right sleeve of the Army green uniform coat. The insignia is worn centered, 1⁄2 inch
below the top of the right shoulder seam (see fig 28–136).
(2) Subdued. Authorized personnel may wear the subdued SSI–FWTS on the right sleeve of the temperate, hotweather,
enhanced hot-weather, and desert BDU, and the BDU field jacket, as described above. The SSI–FWTS is not
authorized for wear on organizational uniforms, except as prescribed in this paragraph.
(3) Other services. The Department of the Navy, the United States Marine Corps (USMC), and the Air Force do not
authorize wear of SSI. Therefore, personnel who served in one of the designated areas during one of the specified
periods, but who were not members of the U.S. Army, are not authorized to wear the SSI–FWTS on their right
shoulder. The only exception to this policy is for U.S. Army members who served with the USMC during World War
II from 15 March 1943 through 2 September 1946.
d. Soldiers who are authorized to wear more than one SSI–FWTS have the option of choosing which SSI–FWTS they will wear. Soldiers may elect not to wear SSI–FWTS. (See appendix F for further guidance on the wear of the
SSI–FWTS.)


and APP F-


Shoulder Sleeve Insignia–Former Wartime Service (SSI–FWTS)
F–1. Applicability.
This guidance applies to soldiers of all components (Active, ARNG and USAR) that deploy during periods of service
designated for wear of the SSI–FWTS, in accordance with paragraph 28–17.
F–2. General.
a. There is no time-in-theater requirement to be authorized to wear the SSI–FWTS.
b. A deployed unit that is authorized to wear an SSI in its own right (or an organic component thereof), in
accordance with para 28–16, will wear that unit’s SSI as the SSI–FWTS. This is true regardless of whether the
headquarters element deploys, and regardless of the number of changes to the unit’s alignment or operational control
(OPCON) during the period of deployment.
c. When a unit not entitled to its own SSI deploys, the OPCON relationship prior to deployment is terminated, and a
new OPCON relationship is established. Members of these units will wear the SSI of the lowest echelon deployed unit
entitled to an SSI in each of their new deployed chains of command as their SSI–FWTS.
d. When there is no intermediate unit that has its own SSI in the deployed chain of command, members of units not
entitled to their own SSI will wear the SSI of the senior Army command in the theater as their SSI–FWTS.
e. Soldiers who are cross-leveled, assigned, attached, or augmenting deployed units, and soldiers who are TDY on
orders through the use of DD Form 1610 (Request and Authorization for TDY Travel of DOD Personnel) will wear the
same SSI–FWTS worn by members of the deployed unit(s) to which attached or OPCON. This does not apply to
members of Trial Defense and CIDC, who will wear the SSI of their respective commands as their SSI–FWTS.
f. Soldiers authorized to wear more than one SSI–FWTS may choose which SSI–FWTS they wear. Soldiers also
may elect not to wear the SSI–FWTS.
g. Precedence was established in Vietnam for elements organic to, or an integral part of an organization to wear the
organizational SSI as their SSI–FWTS.
336 AR 670–1 • 5 September 2003

So, if you are in the US Army, assigned or attached to a unit and assigned in a combat zone, while under hostile fire for 30 days (waivable), you are authorized to wear that units SSI (unit patch) on your right arm.

This help?

[SGTBelcher29]

Originally Posted by field_sailor

3 patches? How does that work? You ahve been there three times, obviously rite? or is there a different way?

Side question: hypothetical:

I have a 5 Soldiers working for me. We are on a convoy in Iraq, we come under fire, we shoot back, we win our little "battle." Lets say oh, 0 US casulties, 10 Insurgent casulties. Do my soldiers earn a combat patch for their unit?

Yes, they would be authorized to wear the 'combat patch' of that unit. If they were, say MPs, and had to support operations from several different units, they would be authorized to wear the SSI (unit patch) of those units. Corps LRS, that directly support several different divisions, frequently have soldiers earn multiple 'combat patches' in one tour.